Speakers everywhere! Has anyone installed a legitimate aftermarket system at this point? If so, are there any learning curves or gotchas vs. ICE cars? Is it even possible to find good speakers to replace every single type in the model 3?
Drizzle
I would gather that it would be very VERY annoying to mess with/install an aftermarket system on a Model 3 (if possible at all without throwing codes everywhere).....just one question though....do you have the premium audio....because if you do....I was wondering why you would even want to change it.....hands down one of the best (if not the best) audio system I have heard in a car to date (and I have heard some nice aftermarket audio systems too).......
I do have the premium audio. Both ends of the frequency range are pretty bad imo though. Bass in the door is muddy and the subwoofer doesn't reach below 40hz when you can hear it. On the opposite end I had to turn the treble almost all of the way down to get rid of the hissing "S" snake sound that was piercing/fatiguing my ears. To be fair, this kind of tinny treble seems to be a trend in cars and cheap headphones these days.
Apart from that I have had pretty good systems before and own reference level headphones. The system is good, but there is obviously some tradeoffs or weird stuff going on in it. Even a 13 band EQ would be a nice addition so I can tune it correctly without compromising vocals over guitar, etc.
As for pros, the amount of speakers and their positioning do make for an enveloping sound stage once you set the balance towards the back seats a little bit. Although even then, it seems a bit ghostly and faded in some of the music I like to listen to (metal).
Apart from that I have had pretty good systems before and own reference level headphones. The system is good, but there is obviously some tradeoffs or weird stuff going on in it. Even a 13 band EQ would be a nice addition so I can tune it correctly without compromising vocals over guitar, etc.
As for pros, the amount of speakers and their positioning do make for an enveloping sound stage once you set the balance towards the back seats a little bit. Although even then, it seems a bit ghostly and faded in some of the music I like to listen to (metal).
I suggest you do two things first, in this order:
1. Connect a "lossless" compression playback device to one of the front USB ports, and try to play back audio through there (I don't know for certain that will work, but it might). See if it sounds much better. If it does, replacing the speakers and amp are a waste of time and money, because it's the digital source that's the problem. It might be this solves the problem entirely for you. The built-in system uses all compressed audio.
2. I that's not much better, try the same device again, except this time find the amplifier, and plug the audio into a trusted set of your own speakers (they can be home audio, they don't have to be 12v automotive speakers) to see if the sound is better. If it's not, then things get much more expensive from there - because it's the MCU audio or software decoding that's the problem. You would have to get your own audio playback device and connect it to your own amp and speakers, bypassing the Tesla system entirely.
1. Connect a "lossless" compression playback device to one of the front USB ports, and try to play back audio through there (I don't know for certain that will work, but it might). See if it sounds much better. If it does, replacing the speakers and amp are a waste of time and money, because it's the digital source that's the problem. It might be this solves the problem entirely for you. The built-in system uses all compressed audio.
2. I that's not much better, try the same device again, except this time find the amplifier, and plug the audio into a trusted set of your own speakers (they can be home audio, they don't have to be 12v automotive speakers) to see if the sound is better. If it's not, then things get much more expensive from there - because it's the MCU audio or software decoding that's the problem. You would have to get your own audio playback device and connect it to your own amp and speakers, bypassing the Tesla system entirely.
I would imagine given the integration of the Model 3 system's that it would be very difficult to replace amplifiers. Speakers are relatively easy but the audio system in the car is so damn good I can't think of anyone really wanting to mess with it 
I am in the process of tackling this, myself. Here's some info I've been able to gather about the audio system in Model 3:
Model 3 PUP audio system
Speakers
# speakers: 15
(1x) 8" subwoofer in passenger trunk well - dual voice coil @ 2x4Ohm, 2x80W (equivalent to a minimum of 160W @ 2 Ohm, see below)
(3x) 4" midrange speakers in dash - 3 Ohm, 33W each
(1x) 1" tweeter in dash - 4 Ohm, 25W (note that this tweeter is passive, meaning it has an inline crossover)
(2x) 1" tweeters at side mirrors - 4 Ohm, 25W each (note that these tweeters are active, meaning they're only sent high frequencies)
(2x) 2.5" midrange speakers in A-pillars - 4 Ohm, 2W (!!)
(2x) 8" woofers in front doors - 4 Ohm, 80W each
(2x) 4" midrange speakers in rear doors - 3 Ohm, 33W each
(2x) 4" midrange speakers in trunk lid - 3 Ohm, 33W each
A few observations:
-The speakers located in the upper A pillars (these are the ones that turn on/off with the "Immersive sound" option) are extremely wimpy... They are rated at 2W!! I don't think I'll even bother replacing them since they're not doing much of anything.
-There are 4 wires (2 channels) going from the rear amp to the subwoofer. This leads me to believe that those 2 channels are bridged internally in the amp, and the sub's voice coils are therefore wired in parallel... for a minimum of 160W @ 2ohm. I say minimum because the subwoofer is marked as 80W x 2 and 4Ohm x 2, and typically wiring up a 2Ohm load gives you a little more power than the sum of the 4-ohm loads.
-I'm a little surprised that the speakers are mostly 3/4 Ohm. Based on Model S and X, I was expecting most of these to be 1/2 Ohm. Makes aftermarket replacement much easier, especially if looking to do it without replacing factory amps.
I'm going to disagree with the other posters in this thread and (optimistically) say that replacing speakers, and adding an aftermarket amp & sub should be relatively painless.
I've already ordered a Focal ISU 200 kit comprised of 8" woofers and tweeters. I figure the stock amp @ 80W / 25W per channel should be enough to drive these adequately.
I've also ordered a mono 300W amp and 10" subwoofer. A 12x12x12 sealed enclosure fits perfectly in the sub-trunk, with room on either side for chargers and tire kits, and even allows you to put the cover back on (though I will most likely create a custom cover with speaker mesh).
I've located an adequate 12V power source under the passenger-side rear seat (directly off DC-DC converter) -> very short run to trunk
Switched 12V for remote lead can be tapped in driver's footwell (as shown in Ingeneerix' video)
The only thing I have not cracked yet is whether there is a line-in type of signal coming into the stock amp. Need to dig into this a little more, but worst case I'll just tap into the wires going to the stock sub and use a line out converter. In either case, short run from the rear amp to my aftermarket amp.
I also plan to replace all 3 4" speakers in the dash with Infinity Reference speakers, and will likely also replace the lone passive tweeter (haven't decided where I'm going to find a single tweeter :-/ )
Not planning to mess with the top A-pillar speakers, or the rear door / trunk shelf speakers yet, and probably won't unless it really somehow throws off the balance.
Model 3 PUP audio system
Speakers
# speakers: 15
(1x) 8" subwoofer in passenger trunk well - dual voice coil @ 2x4Ohm, 2x80W (equivalent to a minimum of 160W @ 2 Ohm, see below)
(3x) 4" midrange speakers in dash - 3 Ohm, 33W each
(1x) 1" tweeter in dash - 4 Ohm, 25W (note that this tweeter is passive, meaning it has an inline crossover)
(2x) 1" tweeters at side mirrors - 4 Ohm, 25W each (note that these tweeters are active, meaning they're only sent high frequencies)
(2x) 2.5" midrange speakers in A-pillars - 4 Ohm, 2W (!!)
(2x) 8" woofers in front doors - 4 Ohm, 80W each
(2x) 4" midrange speakers in rear doors - 3 Ohm, 33W each
(2x) 4" midrange speakers in trunk lid - 3 Ohm, 33W each
A few observations:
-The speakers located in the upper A pillars (these are the ones that turn on/off with the "Immersive sound" option) are extremely wimpy... They are rated at 2W!! I don't think I'll even bother replacing them since they're not doing much of anything.
-There are 4 wires (2 channels) going from the rear amp to the subwoofer. This leads me to believe that those 2 channels are bridged internally in the amp, and the sub's voice coils are therefore wired in parallel... for a minimum of 160W @ 2ohm. I say minimum because the subwoofer is marked as 80W x 2 and 4Ohm x 2, and typically wiring up a 2Ohm load gives you a little more power than the sum of the 4-ohm loads.
-I'm a little surprised that the speakers are mostly 3/4 Ohm. Based on Model S and X, I was expecting most of these to be 1/2 Ohm. Makes aftermarket replacement much easier, especially if looking to do it without replacing factory amps.
I'm going to disagree with the other posters in this thread and (optimistically) say that replacing speakers, and adding an aftermarket amp & sub should be relatively painless.
I've already ordered a Focal ISU 200 kit comprised of 8" woofers and tweeters. I figure the stock amp @ 80W / 25W per channel should be enough to drive these adequately.
I've also ordered a mono 300W amp and 10" subwoofer. A 12x12x12 sealed enclosure fits perfectly in the sub-trunk, with room on either side for chargers and tire kits, and even allows you to put the cover back on (though I will most likely create a custom cover with speaker mesh).
I've located an adequate 12V power source under the passenger-side rear seat (directly off DC-DC converter) -> very short run to trunk
Switched 12V for remote lead can be tapped in driver's footwell (as shown in Ingeneerix' video)
The only thing I have not cracked yet is whether there is a line-in type of signal coming into the stock amp. Need to dig into this a little more, but worst case I'll just tap into the wires going to the stock sub and use a line out converter. In either case, short run from the rear amp to my aftermarket amp.
I also plan to replace all 3 4" speakers in the dash with Infinity Reference speakers, and will likely also replace the lone passive tweeter (haven't decided where I'm going to find a single tweeter :-/ )
Not planning to mess with the top A-pillar speakers, or the rear door / trunk shelf speakers yet, and probably won't unless it really somehow throws off the balance.
I've read about your plan for aftermarket system some time ago, how is the progress so far? Also wondering where you plan on putting the aftermarket 300W amp. I'm curious as to what effects the extra weight and wattage will do to the range. Do you also plan on putting sound deadening material in the doors and trunk?
I've had aftermarket systems in previous cars, and they do easily outperform what the Model 3 comes with, but I'm finding the Model 3's system to be good enough to not spend the extra money.
I've had aftermarket systems in previous cars, and they do easily outperform what the Model 3 comes with, but I'm finding the Model 3's system to be good enough to not spend the extra money.
May I ask what all they did? They added a subwoofer and tweeter in another customer's post I saw... Did they add an aftermarket amp (assuming they did)? If so, is there ANY way you could give me some hints (pics?) as to how they went about getting the line inputs (rca inputs going into aftermarket amp)? I'm assuming they're tapping into some wires at the rear OEM amp (behind the trunk liner on the passenger side).
Would be incredibly helpful to me.
Would be incredibly helpful to me.
So my real question is, how effective are the things like https://www.rockfordfosgate.com/new...urround-sound-oem-integration-digital-signal-processor-now-available-in-stores/ that they used to integrate into the stock system? Is there sound quality lost due to this integration?
Normally, you install a quality, aftermarket head unit to pump out the signal. How does the rockford fosgate 360.3 and similar devices work?
Completely unrelated - a 10in woofer with 7-8in door woofers would be overkill. Glad they took the door ones out. I may leave those in and install a 12 in sub. A 10in sub just isn't beefy enough for low end imo, particularly if you like rap, EDM or metal.
@Feathermerchant - Typically you can't do a simple, direct swap of an oem sub because they are built to require much less power than a decent one.
Normally, you install a quality, aftermarket head unit to pump out the signal. How does the rockford fosgate 360.3 and similar devices work?
Completely unrelated - a 10in woofer with 7-8in door woofers would be overkill. Glad they took the door ones out. I may leave those in and install a 12 in sub. A 10in sub just isn't beefy enough for low end imo, particularly if you like rap, EDM or metal.
@Feathermerchant - Typically you can't do a simple, direct swap of an oem sub because they are built to require much less power than a decent one.
Hmm. I found a JL Audio 8" that only requires 150W.....
I know, 8" seems small. I have a 10" in my Magnum (much larger interior) and it can be way too much.
It is also JL and I really like the sound quality.
I have no idea if the JL would even fit in the 3 or if it is appropriate for the existing enclosure.
I'd need a different amp anyway due to the different impedance. I could probably replace the OEM amp using the OEM power and audio inputs.
Unless the signal is digital.
I know, 8" seems small. I have a 10" in my Magnum (much larger interior) and it can be way too much.
It is also JL and I really like the sound quality.
I have no idea if the JL would even fit in the 3 or if it is appropriate for the existing enclosure.
I'd need a different amp anyway due to the different impedance. I could probably replace the OEM amp using the OEM power and audio inputs.
Unless the signal is digital.
Did some research on the rockford fosgate 3.sixty.3. It's basically two things in one - A factory signal flattener/ resetter, and a dsp.
So what it essentially does is becomes the raw output that a new fancy head unit would provide while also letting you do the amazing tuning that a dsp and parametric EQs let you do.
You can do either of these things separately for cheaper if you wanted.
So what it essentially does is becomes the raw output that a new fancy head unit would provide while also letting you do the amazing tuning that a dsp and parametric EQs let you do.
You can do either of these things separately for cheaper if you wanted.
Funny I dont have my model 3 yet, however I am planning something similar. Rockford Fosgate has another signal processor that might do the job, the DSR1, which has a 3.sixty.3 built in, as well as an idatalink module which in our cases we would just not use. The DSR1 is significantly less expensive than the 3.sixty.3 with the same capabilities and would provide a good foundation for anything going forward. My plan when the time comes would be that module to get me a clean signal, with something like a JL Audio JX500/1D feeding a 10w3 either in the well or fiberglassed into one of the sides of the trunk. From their it will depend on how much I like the rest of the model 3 sound system, but at least if I want to change anything else I have a good preamp signal to work with.
I'm hoping that one of the inputs into the OEM amp is some sort of clean line-in signal. The other option would be that the head unit is doing the decoding and sending the signal directly to the amp on a per-channel basis (real possibility, given how many speakers are in the car and the horsepower that the computer has).
I figure even if there is no clean signal at the amp, I can take the speaker wires going to the sub and use something simple like a LC2i to get a clean
Feather, I toyed with the idea of just replacing the sub and using the stock enclosure... Problem is it's a ported enclosure, and those are very finnicky to get right - and very speaker-specific. Given the fact you also have to match the DVC aspect, and the impedance... it's probably not worth messing with. You're really only going to get a noticeable upgrade if you put some real power to it, anyway.
I figure even if there is no clean signal at the amp, I can take the speaker wires going to the sub and use something simple like a LC2i to get a clean
Feather, I toyed with the idea of just replacing the sub and using the stock enclosure... Problem is it's a ported enclosure, and those are very finnicky to get right - and very speaker-specific. Given the fact you also have to match the DVC aspect, and the impedance... it's probably not worth messing with. You're really only going to get a noticeable upgrade if you put some real power to it, anyway.
Definitely keep us in the loop with your project Defjukie, very curious to see how it comes out. I unfortunately need to wait to February to order mine (long story) so I won’t tackle anything stereo wise until the summer likely. One thing that might not apply depending on what you find is that some cars (like my current 2017 Explorer) put some heavy equalization into the amplified output, guessing to compensate for oem speaker deficiencies. So in this case, if you tap the speaker outputs you would need something that can remove the equilization, otherwise the resultant audio signal that is generated ends up being terrible.
I put in a pair of Infinity Reference 4" in the dash last night. Used this handy video to figure out the disassembly:
I was planning to do all 3 4" speakers, but the center hole has next to no depth clearance, and the replacement speaker just simply would not fit. The left and right holes JUST barely had enough room for the replacement. Overall, it was pretty easy to do and the speakers are cheap enough that I would consider this a no-brainer.
The stock speakers have harnesses, so rather than cut these and splice my wires in, I chose to use male headers from an electronics kit (something like this https://www.adafruit.com/product/3002) and solder my speaker wires to this so I could just plug the pins in to the harness. If I ever want to go back to stock, I can just plug the harness back in to the stock speakers.
Also, there is VERY little clearance to remove some of the Torx screws holding the speakers in place. I had to use a pair of pliers holding a hex bit and turn it that way (i.e. very slowly). If you have one of those low profile ratcheting wrenches, would probably make it a lot easier.
I was planning to do all 3 4" speakers, but the center hole has next to no depth clearance, and the replacement speaker just simply would not fit. The left and right holes JUST barely had enough room for the replacement. Overall, it was pretty easy to do and the speakers are cheap enough that I would consider this a no-brainer.
The stock speakers have harnesses, so rather than cut these and splice my wires in, I chose to use male headers from an electronics kit (something like this https://www.adafruit.com/product/3002) and solder my speaker wires to this so I could just plug the pins in to the harness. If I ever want to go back to stock, I can just plug the harness back in to the stock speakers.
Also, there is VERY little clearance to remove some of the Torx screws holding the speakers in place. I had to use a pair of pliers holding a hex bit and turn it that way (i.e. very slowly). If you have one of those low profile ratcheting wrenches, would probably make it a lot easier.
Im no audiphile...so I agree the sound system in this car is the best ive ever heard. Once people figure this stuff out I would love to hear one and see if its worth doing FOR ME.
Great info.
As for the sound system, the subwoofer is the biggest disappointment. It just doesnt play 40hz and below. Songs with bass feel bad to listen to because some low notes just simply aren't played and leave it feeling empty untilthe next note is played.
Who dat boy by Tyler the creator is a perfect example. The bass line is two notes that curve lower over a second or two. The first note is clearly audible and rumbles, but the second noteright after it just isnt audible/feelable. If you've never had a real subwoofer before you may not even realize what I'm talking about, but its a huge deal to me. Your minds will be blown when you get one that can hit those low notes well.
As for the sound system, the subwoofer is the biggest disappointment. It just doesnt play 40hz and below. Songs with bass feel bad to listen to because some low notes just simply aren't played and leave it feeling empty untilthe next note is played.
Who dat boy by Tyler the creator is a perfect example. The bass line is two notes that curve lower over a second or two. The first note is clearly audible and rumbles, but the second noteright after it just isnt audible/feelable. If you've never had a real subwoofer before you may not even realize what I'm talking about, but its a huge deal to me. Your minds will be blown when you get one that can hit those low notes well.
Thanks for the info.
I have a bunch of new audio equipment that I was going to use in my previous car but never got around to it before trading it in for Tesla. Thinking of doing a full radio build on the 3. Helix DSP, ARC Audio 1200.6, Audiofrog GB Speakers
If I have time this weekend I may try probing the factory amp to see what kinda signals are available. I am not very good with wood working so the sub box and amp rack may be left to a pro.
Which system did you get? and can you provide some details on what you happy with? I just provided a deposit on a level 2 system with a few lvl 3 options. hoping I am happy with the range, base response and clarity. I want to hear orchestra quality classical music to deep bump of old school hip hop... the M3 premium audio isn't doing it for me.
So, I played with the amp a few days ago, here's what I found out:
This amp powers ALL speakers in the car, except for dash 4" speakers and door/dash tweeters (possibly the A-pillar immersion speakers as well).
The left harness (with the smaller gauge wire) powers the rear door speakers and trunk shelf speakers, while the right harness contains power/ground for the amp, and runs the subwoofer and front door woofers. The middle connector has the remote turn-on, however it only measures out around 5V. So either it's just an unconventional voltage, or there's some kind of comm signal coming in there, possibly with the audio signal on the other wire?.
I wasn't able to definitively answer how it's setup, but at this point I'm guessing a single low-level type signal is coming from the MCU and being decoded/crossed over at the amp.
This amp powers ALL speakers in the car, except for dash 4" speakers and door/dash tweeters (possibly the A-pillar immersion speakers as well).
The left harness (with the smaller gauge wire) powers the rear door speakers and trunk shelf speakers, while the right harness contains power/ground for the amp, and runs the subwoofer and front door woofers. The middle connector has the remote turn-on, however it only measures out around 5V. So either it's just an unconventional voltage, or there's some kind of comm signal coming in there, possibly with the audio signal on the other wire?.
I wasn't able to definitively answer how it's setup, but at this point I'm guessing a single low-level type signal is coming from the MCU and being decoded/crossed over at the amp.
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